1. [quote][b]What's your stance on Heaven and Hell?[/b] Or the concept of an afterlife in general? [/quote] Asked by [b]Spidey[/b]. Spidey: Well, the first thing that you need to know about heaven is that God created it in the beginning. "In the beginning, God created the heaven and the Earth." The First Book of Moses, Called Genesis Chapter 1, Verse 1. At the very beginning. Also know that God is the possessor of heaven and earth (Genesis Chapter 14, Verse 22). Wherever God is, heaven is. "Unto thee it was shewed, that thou mightest know that the LORD he is God; there is none else beside him." -The Fifth Book of Moses, Deuteronomy Chapter 4, Verse 35. "Know therefore this day, and consider it in thine heart, that the Lord he [i]is[/i] God in heaven above, and upon the earth beneath: there is none else." Verse 39, there after. And also know that heaven is God's kingdom (The Book of the Gospel According to Matthew Chapter 4, Verse 17 and all over the Gospel of Jesus).
It doesn't say anything about hell being created in the beginning. People think that heaven is above them and that hell is below them, but hell is yet to exist. All throughout the Holy Bible it talks of hell being a place that our heavenly Father sends the wicked after they've been judged. Hell is part of a prophecy that will come about during this Earth age. It wont exist until after the day of atonement. Be sure that it will come about. And that it will come down on the wicked, unrighteous, or those that reject the kingdom of heaven. Jesus' life was prophecized by the Book of Isaiah 700 years before he was born and he fulfilled every prophecy. So as Jesus came about, hell and all that will occur at the resurrection will come about, too. In the Bible it describes the wicked being cast [i]down[/i] into hell. It is because God is in the heavens above and hell will be here on Earth. Don't think that there will run out of room in hell for the wicked. "Hell and destruction are never full; so the eyes of man are never satisfied." -The Book of Proverbs (written by King Solomon) Chapter 27, Verse 20. The Hebrew word for destruction in that verse is Abaddon, which is the Hebrew name of the angel of the bottomless pit. The word means the idea of destruction or realm of dead. Hell is described more as a garbage dump than anything else. If you read over the Book that Matthew wrote at the beginning of the Gospel of Jesus in The New Testament part of your Bible and read all of his parables, they illustrate exactly why there is a hell. People also think that Lucifer is the ruler of hell. But, if you read The Book of Isaiah, Isaiah Chapter 14 around Verses 12 to 17, the same book that prophecizes Jesus' entire life, you'll also see that hell will be a place for Lucifer (also known as Satan). He'll be "brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit." There'll be no "ruling" in hell. Only suffering. Not only is it the place for wicked and unrighteous men, but we see that it is the place for Lucifer, who is the devil (he has many names), and his angels that he persuaded to follow him when he rebelled against God. "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels..." The Book of the Gospel According to Matthew Chapter 25, Verse 41, and then on describing why in that very same verse. In the Book of John in the Gospel of Jesus, it says: "And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation." So here it illustrates that the righteous will eventually go to heaven and the wicked or doers of evil or unrighteous shall condemn themselves to damnation, in hell. Being cast into hell is the second death. It even says, plain as the day is long, "And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. [i]This is the second death.[/i]" -The Book of Revelations Chapter 20, Verse 14. This also illustrates that hell is the lake of fire. It also says earlier on in that very same chapter that the devil shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. This part illustrates how hell will be formed at the resurrection. When it says forever, it doesn't necessarily mean for all eternity for the rest of the existance of everything, but that it will happen over a very, very, [b]very[/b] long time. We're talking eons, here. They'll eventually burn until there is no matter left of them to be burned. Of course, Lucifer will take the longest to burn away. Now, when the wicked or the unrighteous are burning, it is not only their flesh bodies that are burning. It is their soul that is burning, also. Their spirit. The pain may be a thousand times over worse than the pain we may experience in the flesh (The Book of the Gospel According to Matthew Chapter 10, Verse 18; a bit earlier in Chapter 5, Verse 29 it is also mentioned.). Who goes to hell, you might ask? "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire." The Book of Revelations Chapter 20, Verse 15. So make sure that your name is written in God's book and you will not go to hell. Of course, you'll have to read God's words to found out how that is done. So when will we either go to heaven or to hell? "And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust." -The Acts of the Apostles (Acts in your Bible) Chapter 24, Verse 15. We end our lives in death (now the cause of death and why we die at all, that's another question to be answered) and when we die, we are with God. Until the day of the resurrection, when both the righteous and the unrighteous arise from the dead and are judged. But there's so much more to it and you'd have to read the Book of Revelations to get it. It's very hard to read for someone that isn't filled with the Holy Spirit, but if you have ears to hear and eyes to see (thereby reading with understanding), you can figure it out. So, as Christians, we are either baptised and reborn and are born twice and go to heaven at the resurrection to be with God or are unrighteous and wicked and die twice and go to hell to be with all of the other people that are wicked or unrighteous. Why is there a hell? Hell is a place deprived of God's blessing. Here on Earth, nothing occurs without God knowing and God causes or allows occurances to happen (as we know from the book of Job). But hell. Hell is deprived of this. Hell is not a torture chamber. God doesn't torture anyone in heaven and there aren't little devils that poke people with pitch forks. "For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye." The Book of Ezekiel Chapter 18, Verse 32 "Therefore, O thou son of man, speak unto the house of Israel; This ye speak, saying, If our transgressions and our sins be upon us, and we pine away in them, how should we then live? Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?" Chapter 33, Verses 10 to 11 of that same Book. God takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked or their punishment. The wicked bring hell upon themselves and God's words, the Holy Bible, tells you how. So where is the devil now? "And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day." -The Epistle of Jude Verse 6. "For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment," The Second Epistle of Peter Chapter 2, Verse 4. The angels that rebelled with satan are being held, with him, in chains in the abyss. When you read in the Bible that there are "evil spirits" doing deeds or Jesus or his disciples casting out evil spirits, these are they. They cannot physically come here. But satan's spirit or the spirit of his rebellious angels can. Satan isn't dead yet. If you study the Resurrection in the Book of Revelations, it says that he will be let out for a thousand years and he will attempt to lead a rebellion one last time. That's when he and his follows are punished when God hails fire and brimstone down on them to create the lake of fire. There's so much more to this that goes into so much detail, but these are the basics.
posted by: george (reply)
post date: 12.27.03 (6:42 pm)
Nice forum for discussion by the way. I tried this, but everyone just yelled at me for saying something against their beliefs. Glad to see there's a place to intelligently discuss thoughts between one another.
Anyhoo, back to the topic at hand.
If we think of it logically, God's original purpose, as stated in Genesis, is for humans to spread throughout the land and to worship him.
Let's make it simple and assume that 50% of the people are bad and go to "hell," and the other 50% are good and go to heaven. What will happen to the earth? What will happen to God's original purpose?
In Revelation, it's stated that 144,000 people are to reign with Jesus, and the rest will be allowed to remain here on earth, to fulfill God's original purpose.
posted by: Isaac (reply)
post date: 11.20.04 (10:01 am)
Reply to: george
If you read scripture, you'll see that it's written that God made the earth to be inhabited (as it says in the Book of Isaiah Chapter 45, Verse 18 and in Revelations). God does nothing in vain; actually, vanity is a characteristic of sin that humankind possesses. And you MUST remember: heaven is a kingdom. Hell is a grave. The glory of the kingdom of heaven is great, and hell is just a garbage pit, a flaming grave. If you understand the Parable of the Tares and Wheat as Christ taught in The Gospel According to Matthew Chapter 13. Revelations says that those that are reborn in Christ, or are born twice, wont be hurt of the second death, or die twice.
The 144,000 are the servants of God with God's seal that are alive at the time that Christ returns for His anointed. They'll be in heaven, too. But God made the earth to be inhabited, so if you read the beginning of the Book of Revelations Chapter 21, you'll see that God will renew heaven and earth, and the holy city will descend from heaven.
